at least they're not rapists
Jun. 8th, 2009 10:55 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
swatkatOn Rape and Men, by ![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
cereta: "Well, what did she expect, getting drunk like that?" isn't salt in the wound, it is the foundation of the problem.
Indeed.
Personally speaking, I could tell you many stories about 'that time I (or A/or Queen M) was drunk and the guys got me home and made sure I did not die on the way'. I could also tell you stories about the fights I have had with the same guys (and will continue to have, I'm certain) about things like 'Well, why shouldn't I take her photo when she's dressed like that (and is completely unaware that she's being photographed by a random man)?' I could tell you stories about how one of the nicest guys I've ever known was also - for a brief period in his teenage years - one of those boys who thought 'touching' women in crowded streets and public transport was 'just a bit of fun', something he and his friends engaged in as a sport.* In the light of a post like this, I suppose, 'at least they're not rapists' comes as a relief - but nonetheless, I can't help but think of how little we expect of men, even the men we love.
* He is something of an extreme case, because this man is capable of a degree of sensitivity that continues to surprise me (a few days ago, he walked out of a party where two drunken jocks were being rather too friendly with a certain girl and has, on more than one occasion, turned down consensual sex because he knew it was a bad idea even though the other person wasn't thinking at that moment). And yet, he himself told me this story, laughing, unable to comprehend my horror when he said, 'It was just silly fun' - as though the absence of malicious intentions on their part (!!!) somehow made it all right. It wasn't molestation because they never thought of it that way.**
** Even more ironic considering he himself was molested - at a mature age! - by a certain gay guy who is a habitual molester of heterosexual men***. But I wonder if he ever thinks of it in those terms.
*** Said gay guy may never be able to come out to his family, and lives in constant denial about his sexuality, as well as with constant taunts about his effeminate behaviour and general 'gayness'.
cereta: "Well, what did she expect, getting drunk like that?" isn't salt in the wound, it is the foundation of the problem.Indeed.
Personally speaking, I could tell you many stories about 'that time I (or A/or Queen M) was drunk and the guys got me home and made sure I did not die on the way'. I could also tell you stories about the fights I have had with the same guys (and will continue to have, I'm certain) about things like 'Well, why shouldn't I take her photo when she's dressed like that (and is completely unaware that she's being photographed by a random man)?' I could tell you stories about how one of the nicest guys I've ever known was also - for a brief period in his teenage years - one of those boys who thought 'touching' women in crowded streets and public transport was 'just a bit of fun', something he and his friends engaged in as a sport.* In the light of a post like this, I suppose, 'at least they're not rapists' comes as a relief - but nonetheless, I can't help but think of how little we expect of men, even the men we love.
* He is something of an extreme case, because this man is capable of a degree of sensitivity that continues to surprise me (a few days ago, he walked out of a party where two drunken jocks were being rather too friendly with a certain girl and has, on more than one occasion, turned down consensual sex because he knew it was a bad idea even though the other person wasn't thinking at that moment). And yet, he himself told me this story, laughing, unable to comprehend my horror when he said, 'It was just silly fun' - as though the absence of malicious intentions on their part (!!!) somehow made it all right. It wasn't molestation because they never thought of it that way.**
** Even more ironic considering he himself was molested - at a mature age! - by a certain gay guy who is a habitual molester of heterosexual men***. But I wonder if he ever thinks of it in those terms.
*** Said gay guy may never be able to come out to his family, and lives in constant denial about his sexuality, as well as with constant taunts about his effeminate behaviour and general 'gayness'.
no subject
Date: 2009-06-09 07:32 am (UTC)And it's partly because so many men don't seem to understand, even if they do the right thing. When a guy reached up my skirt and felt my crotch in a public place a couple of months ago, all the female friends I told were outraged. When I told my boyfriend, he didn't really react - I suspect he didn't know how to react.
no subject
Date: 2009-06-10 03:53 pm (UTC)